whoa haha

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Siphai
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whoa haha

Post by Siphai » Wed Jul 29, 2015 10:35 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Badnik96</dt><dd>Jul 29 2015, 08:50 PM</dd></dl><div>saying the only reason cbnbc was still going was to preserve kody and josh's records may possibly have something to do with that[/quote]See, that's what I thought it boiled down to. But I suggested that on the first page but I don't know. Josh was suggesting it was something else, or a culmination of things, or whatever&#33; I don't know&#33; Like I said, it's not necessarily a bad thing to want a tournament to continue, or to count, to get your record or your championship to be official or whatever.

Pretty much I said it in the thread originally because I was expressing my opinion that I didn't like crazybots. I was asking whether we really wanted to continue that tournament (in my usual way, ie 4 posts asking 'really'). There wasn't a lot of good blood the last time we were moving through the tournament, what with kody's forfeiture and whatever, and it just wasn't a fun tournament all around. Finishing it for the sake of completion just didn't feel great. Kody said "stfu thx" so I was like, alright, and made my comment about his record. I mean if you're gonna say that then you're prepared for someone to say something back right? He said it in jest (probably) and so I said mine in jest (mostly). Josh made his post and I dropped it. Then you said something on skype about "agh&#33; I can't believe lian is continuing crazybots right in the middle of LoRE2's playoffs" (paraphrasing) so I brought up that barb again. And then (I don't remember the timestamps) like a couple hours later I find myself deadmined.

Was it mean? I mean, I guess? We're not exactly in elementary school though. Like I kinda know why I was deadmined (I think), but no one wants to talk&#33; No one hops on skype or facebook or whatever&#33; Nothing&#33; Not even in this thread, josh dancing around 'trolling' or 'well in aftermath you deleted the power rankings so I Had To Be Careful' or whatever, but he won't come out and point to specifically what I said, or where I said it, or that he doesn't like me and what I post (that's fine too&#33; you don't have to like me&#33;). Instead its the same shit that always happens, someone talks to someone else, behind a third person's back, and no one has the balls to come out to say it out in the open. That's what really gets me. Like we're all 'supposed' to be friends right? Some of us posting here over 10 years. But it never feels like when anyone is ever willing to talk to anyone when they have grievances (I'm guilty of this too). That's what really sucks.

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Post by That Kode Guy » Wed Jul 29, 2015 11:27 pm

Okay, I've refrained from posting here for a while, but I really should because delaying like this has been a bad idea.

I'm going to be honest here and say that a lot of my bitterness here has been fueled by IRL issues. Now I know, Philip, that you said we should be more sympathetic towards real life issues, but I can't really speak about myself like that because I've been taking it out on you guys for a while. The thing is, my life's just not in a very good place and hasn't been for a while. The lowdown is, I took a college course for nothing and have to pay back a shitload of money I don't have, and have been cheated out of jobs. Which fucking sucks. So my self-confidence is practically sagging and, thanks to my permanent disability limiting my social skills, I'm basically a wreck.

BUUUUUT... I've been bringing it onto the forum (and moping about it to Josh, Lian, NFX, and Spatula for a while) and taking my bitterness with me, so yeah. I'm not making excuses for it and that was a stupid thing to do. I'm sorry. But being thus aggravated, I've been looking very negatively at things.

The main issue I had with you, Siphai, is one of the posts you made back in Ruination 3 when I basically made my stupid "I'm leaving" post. I can't exactly find the post, but you posted something about "arguments are fine" and stuff. I took issue with that because... well, they're not, and from my experiences they never have been fine. And I'll still kind of firm with that because if two or more people are arguing back and forth it's not really going to fizzle out without some resentment. Maybe you meant "debate"? Debates are fine. I dunno... maybe I took it differently, wrongly, or whatever. That's my outlook on it.

The other issue I had with you is that I couldn't bring myself I approach you about what the things you were saying because I thought you were trolling solely towards me, almost every single major Skype convo, and because of that, I had it in my head that "Why bother, like he's going to listen to me..." so most of the time I either played along as best I could, or just left. Other than that, though, I've never really been a sociable person, and I'm terrible at getting the point across so... maybe that makes me a bad admin? lol... I still don't even know why Josh randomly made me an admin. :v: I still don't really feel I deserve it. I don't know why everyone else didn't approach you, but that's my story.

Although I must really point this out; I, erm, really don't need to be hounded about my dumb flaws almost every convo we have. Like me not raising Master of Savagery's model up so the plow was level with the ground plane, or not putting wheels on it. Or Kite's dumb attachments that I fully admit were makeshift and ridiculous (and that's why I never used them). Or Spectrum winning CBBR. And you're not the only one to do it. (I'm looking at you Josh&#33; :v: It's getting a bit grating from you as well...) Is this what you wanted me to say all along? Even now, I'm still rather dubious.

So it basically built up and built up and finally the staff decided to make a decision to remove your admin/mod status. For my part, yeah I approved of it. But I still didn't want to do anything myself, so Josh went ahead with it. There, that's how it happened. Was it wrong? In hindsight, yeah probably.

Now, onto CBNBC. I agreed with the majority and thought since the first delay that Lian was doing a terrible job of running the tournament. That eased off once it going again, but then it quickly returned with the QF fiasco and me doing my dumb thing. Now I probably caused the delay, but recently I tried getting Lian to get it over with because it was so close to being finished, and I couldn't understand why he was so stubborn about not posting results until today.

I feel I should explain the true reason why I don't like to see tournaments unfinished. See, it carries over from the FRA Forums. I had a lot of tournaments that I didn't finish properly (Dual Duels, C&B3, Extreme...), so I took it upon myself to do the (very annoying, I'll admit) task of making sure people didn't do the same stupid thing I did. People on FRA didn't seem to mind much. Now, tournaments that have barely started (like GF93's Day of Wreckening) I would have been more sympathetic with the writer, and held off... but even with the first delay, CBNBC had somewhat of a foothold, it was 4-5 weeks in already. But I didn't see Lian giving any indication whatsoever that he would have rather the tournament died than continue it, until today, so I encouraged him to keep going with it after Robot Bastards was ending. If I would have known that Lian wanted it to die that early, I would have held off hounding him. But since it's the Quarter-Finals / Semi-Finals now, I would and still do prefer he just get the final stages over with so he never has to go through this again. I never intended CBNBC to be a chore for Lian at all. I'm sorry. But now you know where I'm coming from.

(AS A HUMOUROUS ASIDE, I STILL WANT MARTIJN TO COMPLETE MECHANICAL NOISE - SERIES 2&#33; :v: )

As for 40 wins... lol. It was nice while it lasted, but it really doesn't mean anything for me. I don't take part in this just for winning, and I'm kind of disappointed that some people still seem to think that. Yeah, of course it's nice to win, it's a bit of a morale booster, sure. But it's a game where nothing matters in the long run. So... :v:

All in all, though, I feel I've probably screwed a lot of people over with my loner attitude so do your worst.
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That Kode Guy
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Post by That Kode Guy » Thu Jul 30, 2015 12:04 am

Anyway I've made Siphai a global mod again, but I want to hear Josh's thoughts before anything else is done. After all this, I'd really like to restore Siph's entire admin status, but what I'd also like is more communication, something I myself haven't done enough of.
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Post by NWOWWE » Thu Jul 30, 2015 9:39 am

Well for my part, the bit about Alex previously deleting a thread really got out of hand. It wasn't really my intention for it to be such a major accusation. It was more supposed to be more of a matter-of-fact statement to give context to why the de-admin action was as swift as it was. Looking back on it, was it too far out of line? Yeah it was. I didn't really want to imply malicious intent on Alex's part, but obviously the situation snowballed from there. So I feel I do owe an apology for that.

Next order of business... re: ancient history. Aftermath.. well I didn't really want to stir up memories of that whole debacle again because no one has any pleasant memories of that, but in hindsight once I mentioned the deleting issue that was probably inevitable. Quite frankly I probably should have known better than to dig up that as an indication of character. It was a stressful time for most of us and we did dumb things that we regret. But I guess I was too busy building a mountain out of a molehill and just grasped onto that to try and make a point and I really should have just let it go from there, but I guess I do have a tendency to be stubborn and thickheaded now and again. :v:

And of course that sort of leads into the whole Tali/Heph controversy since that became the direct counter argument. This has been one of my few legitimate sore points ever since it happened. As this thread has proven (again) it's pretty much impossible for either side to prove it's version is the complete truth. We could go back and forth on the issue forever and probably be no closer resolving it. It's made all the more unfortunate because in the grand scheme of things it probably made no difference who won the fight since neither bot was very likely to win against Teresa so it's basically been a disagreement over one single win. For what it's worth, I have no interest in being in such a morally compromising situation again and would just as soon forget about that whole business entirely.

So much like the Aftermath situation, the initial handling of this situation was pretty well bungled (almost entirely by myself this time) and the situation deteriorated rather quickly from there (again mostly my own doing). There seemed to be a pretty unanimous staff consensus on the matter I just went ahead and took the initiative on carrying it. There wasn't much of a consideration on my part of the immediate consequence. I guess for as flimsy as my provided reasoning was, I probably could have just said "hey I'm randomly trimming admins and I drew your name out of a hat" On the whole that probably would have been a lot less offensive and probably just as legitimate as to what I ended up saying :v:

So considering the whole flimsy nature of the decision and my own horribly bungled attempts at justifying it I certainly have no problem with reversing the whole thing and hopefully writing it off as if it never happened. I guess it was a pretty cut and dry case of overreacting and went too far. Hopefully Alex can excuse and forgive my poor attempts at justification and we can move on amicably.

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Quote:</dt><dd>&nbsp;</dd></dl><div>Although I must really point this out; I, erm, really don't need to be hounded about my dumb flaws almost every convo we have. Like me not raising Master of Savagery's model up so the plow was level with the ground plane, or not putting wheels on it. Or Kite's dumb attachments that I fully admit were makeshift and ridiculous (and that's why I never used them). Or Spectrum winning CBBR. And you're not the only one to do it. (I'm looking at you Josh&#33; :v: It's getting a bit grating from you as well...) Is this what you wanted me to say all along? Even now, I'm still rather dubious.[/quote]Oddly enough, most issues I have in this respect are pretty much opposite of Kody's situation. Rather than have people heckle my designs, I noticed a trend where I would post a design, it would get some amount of praise/respect. Fast forward to when I enter it and it seems like those same people are telling me that the same design has some hitherto unknown fatal flaws that's going to cost me in the long run of season. So I'm just sitting there like "wait, no one wanted to say anything at all about this stuff when I still had time to modify the design?". So basically that ends up leaving me with a bit of a chip on my shoulder during the season and (for at least those bots) it does become about more than just fun with them. And sometimes I'm not fully justified in that.

I guess for my part I've been suffering from more and more of an inferiority complex when it comes to designing robots. I'm pretty much the last person holding on to MSPaint while everyone else is using advanced forms of Rhino or even other programs. It's a lot harder to feel great about designs like Redemption Denied or Meta Ridley when I'm seeing amazing stuff all the time from both Nick's, Kody, both Alex's et al. I mean sure I've posted stuff that people say looks good, but whether real or imagined it always feels like there's the implied qualifier "for a Paintbot". It's why whenever someone like Kody feels a design they post is inadequate I'm like "Dude, it's like you guys are all painting in watercolors while I'm sitting here coloring with a box of crayons&#33;". Further exacerbating for me personally is that any time there's been even an informal discussion on redoing the top 100 CFL bot list is the fact that (even by my own admission) I'd be pretty lucky to have more than 1 or 2 bots crack the top 20 and even MORE lucky for even 1 bot to crack the top 10. Now having a top 10 bot is an enormously impressive accomplishment, but consider that Chris (the former #1 overall since time out of mind) would likely have at least 3 bots in the top 10 himself. So with me recently overtaking the top spot, it feels like I only got there due to entering a large amount of tournaments rather than having actual successful robots.

And to bring it all full circle to address Kody directly, in a situation like Spectrum, it's more of me lashing out at myself for my own failings since I know I squandered a good opportunity with ToC that season. I mean for any flak Spectrum gets for being non-invertible, very few bots that season were in any position to exploit it, so realistically Spectrum earned that spot. He's far from the worst champion ever honestly. And I typically try not to indulge in too much serious heckling (usually limited to nothing more serious than a quip about the cosmetic look of the bot) since I know how it feels to have a bot you feel is good turned into a punchline with Zombie Killer (perhaps one of the more infamous examples). I didn't handle it very well at the time and it's still something of a sore point for me, so I completely understand about being tired of seeing the same jokes you didn't care for the first time being trotted out time and again.

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Quote:</dt><dd>&nbsp;</dd></dl><div> I still don't even know why Josh randomly made me an admin. :v: I still don't really feel I deserve it. I don't know why everyone else didn't approach you, but that's my story.[/quote]And to close out on a somewhat lighter note, I'd like to say I think this is Kody being far too modest about himself. I feel he's done a hell of a lot to help keep tournaments running as smoothly as they can, and not just the Ruination's that he directly runs either&#33; Personally I can't thank him enough for the help he's given during the recent FRR tournaments. I feel he's been an indispensable staff member for quite a long time now.
Area51Escapee,Jan 30 2011 wrote:
Spatula,Jan 29 2011 wrote: I should go 3-1 this week but it'll probably be something like 0-4 or 0-5.
It sucks going 0-5. You lose all 4 of your bot fights for the week and you also lose at life.

Toxic
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whoa haha

Post by Toxic » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:44 pm

This whole thing reminds me of the TDS/AU days, haha.

/outside observer.

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Post by That Kode Guy » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:45 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Toxic</dt><dd>Jul 30 2015, 01:44 PM</dd></dl><div>This whole thing reminds me of the TDS/AU days, haha.

/outside observer. [/quote]This is pretty silly looking back on it lol.
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Post by NWOWWE » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:48 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Toxic</dt><dd>Jul 30 2015, 01:44 PM</dd></dl><div>This whole thing reminds me of the TDS/AU days, haha.

/outside observer. [/quote]Does that mean Franco is going to ban us? :v:
Area51Escapee,Jan 30 2011 wrote:
Spatula,Jan 29 2011 wrote: I should go 3-1 this week but it'll probably be something like 0-4 or 0-5.
It sucks going 0-5. You lose all 4 of your bot fights for the week and you also lose at life.

Toxic
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whoa haha

Post by Toxic » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:50 pm

Yes. Yes, it does.

Don't worry though, I've already made us a new board on Geocities.
Last edited by Toxic on Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by playzooki » Thu Jul 30, 2015 1:53 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>NWOWWE</dt><dd>Jul 30 2015, 09:39 AM</dd></dl><div>Oddly enough, most issues I have in this respect are pretty much opposite of Kody's situation. Rather than have people heckle my designs, I noticed a trend where I would post a design, it would get some amount of praise/respect. Fast forward to when I enter it and it seems like those same people are telling me that the same design has some hitherto unknown fatal flaws that's going to cost me in the long run of season. So I'm just sitting there like "wait, no one wanted to say anything at all about this stuff when I still had time to modify the design?". So basically that ends up leaving me with a bit of a chip on my shoulder during the season and (for at least those bots) it does become about more than just fun with them. And sometimes I'm not fully justified in that.[/quote]I can relate to this, especially in the case of every version of march or die after v1.

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